what is up everything bass fishing what's up bass and kill guard studios here we go like you heard it straight out of mega wear kill guard studios we are back with another episode of bass edge radio that's right here we are with a late november edition And, man, excited to have another show for you. Real quick, hopefully everybody grabbed a hold of the last episode. Maybe our biggest, in a certain way, episode ever here on Bass Edge Radio. That's right, we had Gray Buck, Brian Schmidt, and Weekend Nagler, Mike Grogan, on the last episode, breaking down some episodes. fall fishing, talking a little about how to utilize forward facing sonar more effectively. We talked about fall tactics, different ways that those guys and myself like to catch them in the fall. So it was a fun little shindig. We had a great time. And man, we got an exciting episode for you again. We got multiple guests coming into the show. First, we're going to talk to my main man, Rick Harris. Rick Harris, an MLF Invitational Pro and just a Texas Hammer. I call him a West Texas Hammer, but we'll also talk about why he's now a New Mexico Hammer. So that's going to be a lot of fun to hear from Rick. And then later on in the show, we are going to talk to I'm going to call him right now Wheeler Lake expert, Keith Poche. He just come off a really good tournament there at what I would – Initially, maybe consider the final big event of the year, the Toyota Series Championship there at Lake Wheeler. Keith finished second place. We're going to kind of break down his pattern, also talk about Hayden Marbutt and how he got the championship sewed up there. So, man, this is going to be a lot of fun, going to be a great show. And without further ado, let's get this thing kicked off. Here he is right here. Main man, Rick Harris. What is up, Mr. Harris? what's up kurt I was just on the road like always I'm in my truck right now so I figured you're grooming grooming your mustache yeah it's looking good no big deal it's a nice look bro yeah I've worked on it it's uh I shaved it as a joke to my girlfriend, and she loved it. This was back in May, and so I've had it ever since May because she likes it. Very cool. With your background, I thought maybe you were post-Halloween still kind of wearing your costume. I do love Halloween, but no. Just on the road and pulled over to do this with you, dude. Awesome, man. Well, I'm so happy. You showed up and awesome to have you here as always, man. A lot of stuff to talk about. First off, let's kind of get a recap, man. Where's Rick Harris been? It's always great to talk. If you go back to listeners, if you go back to some previous episodes, Rick has been featured on Jay Kumar's Bass Blaster. If you don't get a piece of that, you need to be a member of Bass Blaster. Rick is a hammer at catching big fish, specifically for his guide clients. out here in texas and um I I kind of set a precursor you've got new mexico now as the home tell me what's been going on in your life rick yeah so you know I've been on my own for a long time and I met a girl her name's allison and we got together and I moved in with her and I'm a new mexico residence now I changed my license everything that's where I live Very cool. So Rick Harris out of Carlsbad, New Mexico. I love that, bro. And funny story, because when I started dating her, I told Kurt, you, I was like, hey, I'm dating this girl. She's from New Mexico, Carlsbad. And Kurt was like, from Carlsbad, New Mexico, Rick Harris. And sure enough, like a few months later, that's the story. So you called it. That is awesome, man. It's been great to see. Obviously, you fished the Invitationals. Had a really good season. I think cashed four out of six. Is that right? Yeah. Cashed four out of seven. That is an awesome season. I mean, the talent level in the Invitationals is extremely good. And cashed four out of six events. How did you enjoy it, man? That was your first year on the bit. You know, you fished Opens before. Yeah. Done very well in Toyotas before. Qualified. Didn't just take a spot in the Invitationals. Qualified for the Invitationals with a top finish in the Toyota Series events in the – what are they called? Southwest Division, I think that's what they call this, Texas Division. So, man, give me some recap. Give the listeners some recap. First year traveling in the country, what was the vibe, bro? It was actually a lot of fun and really cool. Like I was – I wasn't nervous about it because I fished the opens in and I got rocked like I sucked like totally sucked I was like I need to step back and like do my homework and like really take the right steps to get to that level and that's what I did with the toyotas you know a lot of a lot of guys it's not a bad thing or thing but you know they they just shuffle out invites people go in and They don't know what to expect. Well, I knew what to expect. I was confident and comfortable doing this. So I really enjoyed it, had fun. You know, it was kind of stressful, but that's tournament fishing for everybody. Just, you know, trying to figure this out, stress. But I had a ton of fun and I traveled with a really good group of guys. And actually one of my buddy, you know, Alec, he won Angler of the Year. So traveling with him, watching him win Angler of the Year was awesome. Talking about Alec Morrison, the forward-facing sonar specialist. So, yeah, dude, Alec had a crazy year. Cool to have an upfront seat. What was your thought process? Did you feel like, you know, you understood what kind of he did to master the field more or less? Yeah, like he was doing it like he's just good. He's just a natural, just understands fish, and he did his own thing, and I did mine, and we all talked, but like – To fish at that level, you do what you feel comfortable with and what you like to do, and that's what I did all season. I just went to lakes that some I've been before, some I haven't, and just did what I thought I could win with and rocked it. It worked out a few times, getting some checks, having a few finishes, and mean it's just tournament fishing as far yeah now you spend a lot of time on the road you you you know the guiding you you you know guide for big fish out here in west texas and kind of uh you you were working a system where you kind of um you know stayed targeting areas where big fish were biting right yeah and uh it's been fun to watch you have success and guide clients to extreme success and now you're doing a whole lot up in new york in the summertime so you're away a whole bunch how did that work out between you know your tournament fishing your new relationship and and then you know you know guiding and keeping a good business going yeah tournament fishing it helped me a ton because you know, smallmouth, that's a whole different ballgame up there. It really is. Like, you watch it on TV, you can research on it, but until you go do it, you fully don't understand how those fish are so much different than largemouth. They are... one hundred percent different. So to understand those, you know, like two out of the four checks I cash were smallmouth tournaments up north. And that's because going up north, spending time guiding, doing, you know, the camps, just learning smallmouth really helped me for the season because like usually any big tournament trail you finish, whether it's, you know, opens, BPT, elites, invitationals, like events go on up there for at least a quarter of the season. So you better be well-rounded up there to compete. Yeah. It paid off. Well, it's easy to see why from, from my vantage point, it's easy to see why you had success in the invitational as you've, you've kind of laid that craft that you had said, you know, kind of jumped in early in seventeen and said, well, you know, I better check up. But then you did your homework, man. You went up north several summers and kind of got that smallmouth out and you became more efficient fishing in the southern fisheries as well. And just kind of get more comfortable in what, rick harris likes to do so uh yeah it's it's it's very cool to watch I I know recently I was I was checking you know we chat at least I don't know maybe once a week or so but but just recently we haven't talked much since then you went to a um an event there in central texas and took some soldiers fishing tell me tell me a little bit about that yeah we've been doing that for probably my fifth or sixth one my buddy nick he runs the whole thing uh he's asked me to do it every year and I go do it's a it's a program called higher ground and they uh just take veterans to do they don't don't just do fishing I mean they go hunting ice climbing whitewater rafting horseback ride they do all sorts of stuff over the country this is just one program that they do in texas that they take the guys fishing and uh we've gone to ivy past few years and caught some really big fish like ten pounders and says well you know ivy is doing a little it's been tough so we went to brownwood it just flooded so oh sorry hold on oh you're good stuff went stuff went off on me Car battery died. Love that. So we went to Brownwood and fished and had a blast. It's truly – to take soldiers or veterans that have – and these guys that come, they've been in combat situations. They are the real deal. This is – This is cool. And to mess around with them and watch them catch fish and see them act like little kids reeling in a fish, smiling and laughing. I mean, it's fun as hell, dude. I'll keep doing that until I have it. That's awesome. So let's kind of jump right into fall fishing. Obviously, this is just last week. And tell me about what the bite was like in Central Texas. We watched an MLF event about... It's been about three weeks ago now, Patriot Cup that went on at Ivy and Brownwood, kind of that similar area where you were fishing. What's the fall bite like out there and kind of what were you leaning on to get on some fish? Yeah, typical fall deal for me is, you know, first thing I notice when you go to the lake in the morning, there's fog. Temperatures are cooling down. There's fog on the water. That is your first sign. Okay, stuff's cooling down. Fall's here. Shad is moving back in the creek. The main thing I think about is shad. Moving baits. Moving, moving baits when it's just starting to happen. uh I I like to lean on top water that's my favorite thing to do like a buzz bait a frog that's what I love to do or you know I had a swim jig tied on all moving shad baits so that's that's what I go for uh you know I like to start in the mouse of creeks Cause you don't know where those fish are, you know, has it been cooling off for a few weeks? Did it just happen? So you don't know where they're at. So I like to start at the mouth and work my way back. And usually you will find them from the first quarter to the half at the beginning. Gotcha. You say buzz bait, man. What, you know, you, A lot of people fish buzz baits in the springtime, specifically around the spawn or just after the spawn. Kind of gets forgotten again until the fall. What do you think makes that bait so special, man? I think it's one of those deals. What I like to think is in the springtime too, just like the fall, fish are moving. Uh, you know, they're moving up to spawn, fish are moving. So you're moving a buzzbait so efficient to just chunk out there and wind back there fast. You know, like a walking bait or a frog or even like a plopper style bait, you're still winding it, but it's a lot slower. You know, it takes time to walk a frog bag. It takes time to walk a spook bag. It takes time to reel a plop or something through and a buzzbait just comes through so quick so you can cover more water. That's why I like it. And I've always had a really well. Yeah. yeah a big deal in the fall is fish are moving you're moving you know it's really you're not sitting on a point casting and dragons you know you're moving with the fish because they're just up chasing shad you might be fishing the bank then right behind you three fish are blowing up you throw back there and catch one and they'll never blow up there again Right. Right. Yeah. Got that trendy deal with, you know, throwing plastics, you know, now, you know, I think the first trendy thing several years back was, was the horny toad or some kind of toad on, on a buzzbait. Now you're seeing, you know, guys throw, uh, you know, swim baits, um, gosh, that I know you're a strike King guy, um, throwing a menace on a buzzbait. Um, what, what is it? Do you think that makes a huge difference? Like the, the profile between, um, you know, the skirt versus plastic and, and, and how do you determine, you know, which way to go? I do. I mean, me and my buddy Cody Ross had this conversation the other day. Cause he told me, he goes, man, I've never thrown a toad on a buzzbait. And I was like, man, He goes, I think they'll still eat it. I'm like, yeah, totally. They'll eat it with the skirt. They'll eat it without the skirt. What I think it is, you can, that toad or that menace, or I like actually a punch bug. That's what I've been throwing them back at a buzzbait. It just has a thick profile, kind of heavy. You can reel it faster in the water. And what it does, it allows you to get longer casts because it's, you know, it's weighted. The plastic's heavier than a skirt, so you get longer casts. And then as soon as you click over, you know, you're on top of the water. Because that plastic is, you know, it's not sinking, it's kind of staying, you know, above the water. So boom, you're on top of the water, covering water and, you know, gives you a little more weight to get accurate cast by lay down, by dock, under a dock, a grass line. It just, it's just more efficient is the bottom line. It's not that they see it and they're like, oh, there's a bigger profile to eat it. No, it's just more efficient for you to make more casts. Like it, man. I like it. I think those legs probably pull it to the surface quickly too, like you were mentioning. And it's skipping, you know, that was something I forgot about. I remember, you know, down here at Amistad, we don't have a whole lot of docks and I've been fishing out West. Clear Lake's got some docks, but, but everyone nowhere else out there has gotten any docks. But that's something I forgot is how well a plastic bait you mentioned, you know, skipping is, is, is really cool. So, Cool, man. Well, Buzzbait, and you mentioned, what else was he? I think you mentioned Swimjig. Yeah, Swimjig, because we run grass. So, you know, Swimjig is just the perfect bait to reel something faster, get, you know, grass and stuff like that. Or a Chatterbait, or, you know, even like a one point five square bill on rock this time of year is great. You see Shad, just... Throw a one point five. I mean, KVD did it for years and one of the most successful anglers ever. So you're going to throw a pay. Yeah. You see you see sometimes people getting on their trolling motor and just kind of, you know, going around, you know, from point to the back to the point to the back. Are you more concentrating? You had mentioned the backs. Are you kind of running from back to back to back to back to cover more? uh higher percentage areas once I find out where they are like right now you know like earlier in the year they're going to be kind of the mouse wherever the shout but you know here when it starts cooling off big time more the backs all that and even in the middle of the channel I'll change baits get a jerk bait going scope with you know z two or something like that throwing on fish so In the fall, it's just a big junk fishing deal. I mean, you can go do what you want, but there's different deals where a big fish bite or numbers bite. You can tune it up and find a bait that does that. Great point. I was just thinking, probably one of the most difficult times of year to... catch big fish regularly or just kind of get that you know five plus or four plus or just depending on what fishery you're on that that better bite especially if you're tournament fishing to kind of take you over the top do you you know and I I guess it's just there's a lot of fish wandering out there right and of course we can scope them now but It's still tough to get a big bite this time of year consistently. Do you have specific baits or techniques that you try to lean on to kind of, I don't want to say stop catching numbers, but maybe just potentially get a bigger bite? Yeah, like we talked about earlier, like, you know, a lot of tournaments can be won in the fall without a limit. You know, I've won tournaments with four fish. You see the tournaments lately, like dudes will have four or three and win the thing. You know, I think the guy at Ozarks, NPFL, won with like thirteen fish or something for three days. So like you find you're in the fall, you find what you're comfortable with and what you like and what gets a big bite. Usually once you figure out that big bite, just do nothing else. just burn it down and if you get three good you're still in it you get five or even better you have potential winning but that's that's what I look for and it's usually for me top water it's either a top water buzz bait spook frog something that nature I can burn or you know still if it's a grass lake get a big weight in grass this time of year can get some big fish out Absolutely, punch a ram off. Exactly. But both of us love the veggie bite. Yeah, exactly. That's for sure. You know, we did a tortoise fierce championship last year on Table Rock. Right. And it was like the first big cold front fall, and we saw those fish really in practice. They weren't doing the bait deal, the middle of the channel, chasing bait. And then during the tournament, they really started keying in on that, and that's what – that's what did it for me at least for a good finish figured that out and just went with it and so do you feel like that's because it got colder and let's let's kind of bring that into the mix on our kind of little last segment here of talking fall fishing but um man it's really starting to get cold right now this week um I've seen down in florida you know temperatures in the high forties low fifties I mean that's not something that That is legit kind of late fall starting in. What happens differently once those water temperatures kind of get out of the low seventies, high to mid sixties and start to drop into those low sixties and maybe even in the middle part of the country, you know, getting into some high fifties at this point. yeah the the fish congregate for sure the bat you know the shad and everything starts congregating so the bass follow I mean they're they're on bait look start looking for loons start looking for bait fish on the surface just bait bait bait and uh you know jerk bait's great uh still you know it's a little cooler but you can still throw a top water don't be afraid to throw the top water around it'll get you a big bite and then with live scope now just throwing a minnow at fish is just it's so efficient that it's hard to get away from that it really is it's so efficient you can see the size you can not waste any time so when it's really starting to get like that's what I do and another deal I know I just said bait bait bait shad shad shad but crawfish molt around this time of year too That's kind of a sneaky deal that a lot of people don't know. Crawfish really start to molt when the temperature's cool. They'll get up shallow. So, you know, like a red crank or a jig, that is the start of that bite is like... when, you know, they start getting the backs, case and bait, you can really get on a craw bite too. That's kind of looked over a lot of times. Right. I love the late fall too, man. I see that where, you know, more people getting up in the deer stand, the more the fish are biting kind of thing. And I feel like you go from a good fall day, like mid fall to being, you know, eight to twelve fish is a good day. and an exceptional day is maybe fifteen fish but man you get in that late fall exactly what like you were saying those fish start congregating and they just get more grouped up and all of a sudden a good day is now twenty or twenty five fish and a great day is thirty or thirty five fish yeah exactly it's a fun time of year. Now, when do you, when do, when will you see that fall off? And then finally it kind of moves into the, to the winter zone. Is that a water temp thing? Yeah, I think it's, it's where you're at in the country. I think it's, it's a water temp thing. And, and you know, you get, cause some lakes like down, you know, the Amsterds, I don't think it gets below fifty five a lot of the time. Yeah. You know what I mean? So really from like, late fall the spawn is pretty much the exact same right but you know you go up north highland lake something like that or you know you start getting those colder temperatures you know you start getting the yeah ice and like really like I think below fifty four and below they really start doing their wintering patterns you know you're throwing a jig a lot you're throwing a rig you're you know you're throwing a jerk bait let it sit there a long time and slowing down a little bit Great tips, man. Great tips. All right, man. I'm looking forward to getting out some more this fall. It's like I say, this is our first big, big cool front, you know, in South Texas. And I know like all across, you know, Louisiana, Alabama, Florida, this is the first event. Really good chill. So excited about it, man. Excited about it. It's going to be fun. All right, twenty twenty five. We got a little change for Rick Harris moving from MLF over to B.A. Well, I say moving from MLF to Bass. You fished the opens like you mentioned back in the day of twenty seventeen, twenty sixteen ballpark. But man, you got new plans for twenty twenty five. Tell us about it. Yeah, I've always told myself, you know, like. I wanted to fish the Opens, but the nine tournaments, for me, I just couldn't do it. Some guys can. It seemed far-fetched. It did. For me, it did. That's the cool thing about fishing. There's no right and wrong place for you to be. It's where you want to be. Your choice and what's good for you and all that. Somebody else's choice might be a complete option. It's good for them. My choice was West Coast, right? Exactly. Dude, it's cool. And you're kicking ass, too, which is awesome. You did a great year. Right up till the end, it was all good. Yeah. It kind of fizzled out. Yeah, probably because I was there. That's why. Yeah, more pressure, more pressure. Yeah, exactly. But yeah, they split the divisions. They got four tournaments in each division, which is doable for me. Then they take the top fifty from each division and do the EQs, the last three tournaments of the year in the fall. Yeah. It seems more realistic for me to do, so I'm going for it. Yeah. Well, I'm excited about it, man. I really like the two-division, four-event-per-division format, and then that final three on, I don't know, Mystery Lakes, I guess you might call them. Yeah. and, uh, flush in some elite series anglers in there and see where, where it all ends up. So, uh, it feels like a really good opportunity without the, uh, wild financial risk, if you might say. Exactly. Yeah. And, you know, and, and I know in the EQs, I think the entropy is going to be a little higher. So the payout would be a little higher. So you can actually go make a little, little money. Yeah. Yeah. It pops up from, uh, what, twenty-five to thirty-five or is it two thousand and thirty-five? I can't remember. Two thousand and thirty-five. Two thousand and thirty-five. So... Yeah, it's going to be a good payback. Probably better than the no-interest-free payback at the Elite Series, other than maybe the top ten. There'll be a lot of Elite guys now wanting to get in just because of a good payback. Yeah, exactly. That might be interesting to watch. I didn't think about that until just now. It'll be interesting how that rolls out. Well, that's cool, man. Rumor is you're going to squeak in a few Westies. Yeah. So, you know, I've fished the one bass open years ago with you on a meet. I was actually, I travel with Kurt. I fished in the AAA and it's so much fun. Well, I finally got to go back this year and fish and it was a blast. Like Billy runs a great tournament. It's a cool vibe. I mean, you're fishing for, I mean, it's one of the biggest tournaments in the country that open is like, it's fishing for what? A hundred and eighty thousand dollars or something like that. Like you're fishing for some scratch. For a sixteen hundred dollar entry fee. Pretty, pretty wild. It's unreal. And then, you know, of course, I guess it was last year, their first year they started doing like more events regularly. Yes. Last year was the first. Twenty twenty four was the first year they had a five event series. That's correct. Yeah. And they look good. They ran good. You did them all. You said nothing but good words. You said you've had a great time. And I'm going to jump in a few that have us. You won in May. I'm definitely going to do. uh I've actually have a she's been a bucket list of mine for years you know I saw aaron martin's win flipping reeds and I thought that was the coolest thing I've always wanted to go there and then uh hopefully mead and the us open mojave just depends on that eq schedule yeah they haven't dropped the dates on that yet so once that's finalized I'll Well, I know that I'm making that top fifty. Absolutely. And I know that people love to see out west. You got a lot of a lot of friends out there and a lot of people following you that enjoy watching you travel all over the country. So that'll be cool, man. New guide business. Let's talk about that. I say new. You're back on. You know, you're kind of doing your own thing. Yeah, just doing my own thing. Captain Rick, I got you know, I've sold shirts and hats for years and I just actually dropped some hats and shirts. last month and they're all gone I mean I was blown away like I I posted some hats and they were sold out within like four hours wonderful so that's really cool thank you for anyone who's bought a hat or a shirt the past like that means a lot to me it's so cool so I'm keeping it going uh I'm just gonna travel you know in between tournaments and and god Usually you're running this big bass thing. You really like to put clients on, you know, attempt to put them on exceptionally large fish, you know, nine, ten, eleven pound fish. What do your lakes look like this year? And do you have some dates you can kind of float out there so people can look at their schedules and maybe maybe jump in and get on board with Captain Rick? yeah if you want to come fish with me of course hit me up on instagram or something like that rick harris fishing but I got cool dates I'm really excited about these dates and what where I'm going I'm going to uh the first is in january I got the fourteenth through twenty first open and this is in louisiana on cane lake it is shallow grass and you have a chance of catching a ten to twelve like giants like yeah you know it's gonna it might be cold but you can throw you know you know, a Thunder cricket, a two tap red eye shad and just get shallow and dirty with them in the grass. And, you know, that's one of my favorite bites. So to do that, you have a chance catching a giant. Yeah. It's cool. You know, and then, uh, pretty much from like, uh, January to March, I am tournaments and then the classic and then not that I'm fishing. I just go work for sponsors. I'm actually going to have my own booth at the classic this year. So come stop by. I'll have shirts and hats for sale. Say what's up. And then I'll have those guide dates there too. If you want to book a trip there, you're more than welcome. Uh, I'm pretty busy till then. So April is open. I've got like three weeks in April. I'm open and I'm going to go to Bodark Lake. It's a new lake that just opened up in Texas. It's over, you know, Northeast Texas, kind of South of Texoma. And, uh, I got April, what is it? Fourteen through twenty-third open there. Nice. And, uh, that's going to be shallow spawn, uh, You know, flipping, you know, it's flooded. It's a brand new lake. Yeah. I saw some videos. I saw some videos on it this year and cover out the wazoo. Exactly. Like get down and dirty with some braids and twenty five pound tests. And, you know, guys are catching nine pounders. Texas Park and Wildlife have put a lot. of man hours into making this lake great. They had ponds all over where the lakes flooded with thirteen pounders in there already. There's giant fish in there to be caught. We're going to go do it this April. You've been around a while. How many new lakes in your lifetime have you fished? Not many. There was a few in Virginia when I lived back there that I went and fished. The first you know, six months or eight months that they were open. Um, I never, I never really got, got a chance to see them grow, you know, which was unfortunate because I think that's, you know, like Bodark, I think is going to be great the second year. I think the first year you catch a lot of fish. Yeah, they're moving, but, but all those nutrients get flushed into the system and those fish grow so fast. So I think, uh, you know, year two, three and four are, are the, and maybe even five or King Kong years for, for fresh lakes. So, uh, yeah, man, I haven't, I haven't had a chance to do that a whole lot. Uh, yeah, I've never fished a new lake, so I'm, I'm chomping at the bits. Like I'm jealous. I'm jealous. It's going to be a lot of fun. Hold on. Yeah, no worries. So where do you head after April? What's next on the schedule? So then, you know, tournaments, and then, of course, like I said, I'm going to fish Havasu, that one open, and then, you know, we got the camps, and then... Which we're going to announce camp dates here in just a minute, so y'all stay tuned for that, too. Yeah, we'll do camp dates, and then up to New York, I've got dates there. I've been guiding there up to past, like... Five or six years now. It's been... So, you're going to concentrate on the St. Lawrence again? Yep, St. Lawrence. In Ontario? Yep. I got early dates, which is cool. Like, June... Only, like, a week. Like, June twenty-first through twenty-six, which... That's open a weekend. Yeah. Open a weekend. Right. Open a weekend. So those fish are dumb, usually on beds. It's crazy. I mean, it is like you hear about it, but until you do, you're just like, you legit have a hundred fish days. And the smallest one you'll catch is like almost four pounds. yeah like it's we did it a couple years ago and it was we all talked about it like wow this is probably the best smallmouth trip we've ever had and so go back yeah then I'll you know go do tournaments icast all that and then I'll come back probably uh in july july twenty first through thirtieth and then I'm heading back home so those are my those are my new york dates I have open right now if uh If you want to come catch Big Smallmouth, give me a call, man. It's super fun. Love to hear. Love to hear. We kind of precursored the camp. Let's go ahead and launch it, man. We're going to kick camp off here at Lake Amistad. So this is Pro Bass Camp. Rick and I have been – I guess I founded it, right? You did. Rick's been a huge part of this camp, and he participates in all of them. He's going to be at all three for twenty twenty five. And, dude, we're going to kick this thing off. Amistad, March twenty eight through June one. We're going to host twenty four campers down here at Lake Amistad for session number one. May. You said March, May. Ah, yes. Yeah. March through June. That'd be a hell of a camp. That would be a great camp. I would love to do that. May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, May, Spring, early summer, it's just fish are hungry. They want to eat. There's vegetation grown. It's just going to be fun. A lot of top water, a lot of chunking of wine. It's just pretty much those times of year, whatever you want to do, you can go catch them. It's so much fun. I'm going to be excited for it. It's going to be great. More vegetation. Amistad's got vegetation, but it's kind of been a little lacking, but man, still the fishing here has been really good. Yeah, we catch a ton of fish, like it's fun. I tell you, that's the great thing about Amistad is you learn a whole lot about how to correctly present a lure because you get positive feedback with tons of bites. We'll probably get less bites at Toledo, but it'll be a little bit different fishing, a little bit different techniques there. And then Amistad, Session three, back to New York, Oneida Lake, July six through July ten. It's been really good the last two. When we first started going to Oneida, it kind of sucked. It did. We were getting like... A boat would get like twelve bites a day. They'd be good fish, but like... But now... Dude, you can go fish largemouth and hammer them. Smallmouth quality is getting insane. They got gobies in there now. The population is just getting – the lake is just getting better and better, and I'm excited to go back there. I really love that lake now. It's so much fun. Well, if you've got a youth that loves to fish, basically the ages are twelve to eighteen years old. And there's no hard line on that. But so if you've got a youth that loves to bass fish, wants to learn more from some great instructors, man, we've got some great camps. And you can go check that at Pro Bass Camp Instagram. Or you can just email me, dovekp at hotmail.com. But let us know you're interested. Me and Rick will be putting on some sweet camps for twenty twenty five as well. So, man, I'm excited about your garden, though, man. Some Great Lakes, Caney. how do you say that bode bodar yeah bodar dude it's spelled crazy listen to how you spell this thing b-o-i-s right yeah b-o-i-s and then d apostrophe capital a rc how does a texan come up with that I don't I'm not sure but no idea but that's gonna be great and then you're going to the st lawrence to kick off and then and then we'll be at camp up there too so uh yeah Man, it's going to be an exciting year. You're going to have a busy year. Appreciate you stopping by Bass Edge Radio. You got any final thoughts for the listeners, Rick? Thanks for having me. I've been on here before, and I've told you this. I listen to Bass Edge. when it first started, when it was like the only pod, it was like, it was like, it was the only podcast. And I listened to every episode and like this, it's cool. It's still going. It's cool. You got, you got going. I remember when you became co-host doing it. So I'm really happy on Bass Edge radio. It's taught me so much and, you know, just keep doing what you're doing, dude. I appreciate it. We'll make sure that we check into Rick Harris. It's been great. Happy on the show. Guys, we're going to say hello to Keith Pochette. So we've got more Bass Edge Radio coming up. Rick, again, appreciate you, bro. Take care. Have a good one. Bass Edge Radio. Be back right after this. you know the importance of protecting your investments so choose the protection the pros pick grinding sand abrasive rocks and concrete ramps are no match for our patented technology the mega wear keel guard is made tough and made to stick install it yourself in less than an hour providing the most dependable most trusted protection for your boat guaranteed for life Insist on the original keel guard the pros have picked for twenty-five years. MegaWear keel guard. 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It's better if you turn it sideways. People can see what you really look like. There you go. We got Pooshasty clean. Yeah, we got him clean in the camera. Dude, what is going on? Man, Birdman, I'm just, you know, I'm just trying to survive. I'm just trying to survive. Well, it looks like you've been doing all right trying to survive, dude. We're going to break down some fall fishing here. But, man, you had a good year, a good year. You had a good year. You had a good year. You had a good year. You had a good year. You had a good year. You had a good year. I've qualified two in a row now, so maybe I started using hooks now. You started figuring something out, right? Well, I don't know how long it's been. I'm going to say... Six years ago, Keith said, screw it. I'm fishing in the back, and I'm going to go catch them back there. I don't care where I go, what it looks like. I'm going to figure out how to get back there, and I am going to catch some bass. It all started, and we talked about this before, in the MLF Selects. Keith finally said, I'm going to do what I like to do, and I ain't going to hear from nobody else, and I'm going to go try to kick somebody's butt doing it. And I'm going to say, bro, you've been doing it ever since. Yeah, I tell you, you know, I felt like I had like a restart or a, um, I was able to just go fishing and not really care, you know, not no points, really nothing to lose and official selects and just to go fishing and kind of experiment a little bit, if you will, and started doing some things I really enjoy doing in an actual tournament atmosphere. Kind of opened my eyes to some things. And, you know, of course, I've gotten a little bit more confident as the years goes on and more of the things I figured out. And I've just went all in with it, man. I've got the little boats. I mean, it's just I went extreme with it. And, I mean, heck, it's working right now. I'm just going to keep doing what I'm doing. Two red crests in a row cannot, you know, can't take that away from nobody. You know, you got two down, many more to come. And, man, last big term of the year, twenty twenty five Toyota Championship. Everybody's watching it. It's one of the last big events going on from MLF, from Bass or anybody for that matter. And anyway, you know, Poche had a good day one. And then all of a sudden. you went bonkers bro just absolutely out of freaking control weighed twenty seven daggone pounds now I know you've talked about this to a few people on social media and we saw the fish coming out the live well the day of the tournament anybody didn't see that they missed it if you just google keith poche toward a championship you're gonna see the instagram video because it got lots of views but uh yeah and we're gonna talk a little fall fishing how does a fella go From sixteen to twenty seven and an OK day, but one fifty thousand dollars doing it your way. Toyota Championship. Kurt, you know, you know the spill, bro. I mean, I don't care who you are. If you if you're not on the West Coast, if you if you on the eastern Central America, eastern coast. I mean, a twenty seven pound bag has to fall. I mean, it just has to be your date. And I have never had a bag that way. I've had I've had twenty five in Florida. And like I said, I mean, Florida, I mean, you catch up or twenty, thirty, whatever. But I mean, honestly, to be to do that in the fall, man, I don't even know. Like I had one little area, you know, I'm not doing the whole backwater stuff like I had been doing because Wheeler's been dropping. You know, you know, most lakes drop, you know, in the fall, whatever. How much does Wheeler drop? About five feet, six feet? You know, I don't know exactly. I think it was about four foot low when we were there from from full pool. So, I mean, that's that's a good bit of water. Three and a half or four foot. So, I mean, any fish that were back in, you know, way back in some vegetation or way back in creeks, them fish starts pulling out and pulling out to bunch up. You know, they start feeding, you know, for the winter. Typical fall stuff. And, you know, this particular spot I had was a stretch of lily pads. It had a little ditch, a little gut. You can see it on Google Earth. You can't really tell in person when you're there. I mean, you can, but it's better to see it on Google Earth than history. You can see there's a little deeper gut that goes through those pads, and that was the juice spot. Of course, I fished it the first day, and I didn't really know what I had because I found it the last day of practice. Another boat come in the first day with me. They were on the opposite bank. I was kind of nervous. I was trying to guard it. I was thinking, man, I got fifteen, you know, sixteen. I'm like, I'm doing good. You know, I don't really want to catch me anymore. Even though I had an opportunity to catch close to twenty the first day, some just didn't get it good. But so I'm thinking going into the second day, I'm feeling good. Like I'm going to make the cut. I'm going to catch me another fifteen or so. Man, I pulled up there, man. It was it was a. Hey bro, I can't even explain it. Like now, now y'all were putting out a, if nobody, y'all were putting out a ditto landing, which is way, you know, pretty far up the, the, the Tennessee river from, from Decatur, you know, kind of what people know as Wheeler, right? Decatur flats. Uh, what is that? Ingalls Harbor landing where, you know, what? Ninety percent of the events probably go out of, and most of the big events go out of on Wheeler. And, um, Was it a long time to get, you know, that mid-lake region where you were catching some fish? Yeah, it was an hour run for me. Hours. Of course, I was at a twenty-foot gator tracks on a boat with a two-fifty Mercury. You know, I'm running, you know, close to seventy. But it was sixty-plus miles one way for me to run this. So, I mean, there was no, let me hop in my little eighteen-foot GT series with the one-fifteen. You know, I mean, it'd be a three-hour round trip instead of a two-hour round trip. So, you know, it was just pointless to run the little boat in this particular event. But, no, it was one of them days that, man, every bite I had, you know, I capitalized on. I got it in the boat. And I was done by ten o'clock. When you sit down after an hour run, how many casts before you catch the first good one? You know, I never started right there on the juice spot because, you know, I'm running in there. I'm like balls of the wall. You know, I don't know if somebody's going to be there or not. You know, I'm just trying to get there. I mean, I'm just running. And I'm shutting down like pretty close. So, I mean, once the waves settle, I kind of start just before the juice. Right. So, I mean, I'm catching one on my second or third cast. I mean, there's just so many fish in there. But, you know, a lot of them are small. Um, so yeah, I'm kind of inching towards the juice spot. I kind of want to, you know, get to get, get things back, work in my hands. I know if I'm not, you know, just trying to loosen up. Yeah. So you just want to load up on the juice all of a sudden and missed one, like a dummy. So, uh, so yeah, so I, it was probably closer to nine. Uh, you know, you know, I left about seven thirty from, uh, from that ditto landing, uh, our run. Got in there, you know, took a leap, you know what I'm saying, after I'd run an hour. And, you know, you get everything laid out and start fishing. I mean, I was closer to nine. I start really getting on them. But, yeah, I was done before ten o'clock. Nine forty-five, I had twenty-seven pounds. Dude, let's see. You got a co-angler in this tournament, which normally you don't fish with a co-angler in BBT. Yeah. Man, what's his reaction? Are you just so dial-focused? Like, oh, my God, another big one. Oh, my God, did you see that? Another big one. There's eyes like this. Every time I look back, he's like, his eyes getting big. Right. He's trying to catch one. Like, he had an opportunity to catch a big one or two. You know, like, but because he knew. I talked to him. You know, we did a little interview the other day. Right, right. He's like, man, he said, I was just getting sick to my stomach. I knew once you caught that twenty pounds where you was about to leave. And I don't blame you. I don't blame you. But I was just trying to do everything I can. Trying to get his piece of the egg, trying to get his piece of the pie. I don't use nets. I don't use nets. And I tell my co-runners going into it, I said, look, man, if you want net, bring you a net. I'll net your feet, but you ain't netting my feet. So I didn't even have a net in the boat. I'm like. at the front casting. So he don't see the fish really. Cause they're in these thick lily paths. He don't see the fish till I get it in the boat. And I mean, everything's happening so fast and I'm, I'm catching a fish and I'll get it. Boom. They go right in the live well. So me and him are estimated. Twenty two, twenty three. We really didn't know. Cause we didn't, we didn't, we didn't take, I didn't take time to like, you know, Hey, you know, nah, get back up or make another cat. Yeah. Yeah. So, All he knew is they were big, and I knew they were big, and we didn't have a clue. And he was trying to catch them like me. But, man, I was doing everything I can to kind of – I mean, doing what a pro does. You try to guard your spot. But he did have an opportunity. Yeah. That's cool, man. So you're done at ten o'clock. You think you got twenty-two, twenty-three. What do you do next, dude? Man, I put my rods up. I honestly do. And, you know, I got to thinking, I'm like, you know, I have fished for a week or whatever, you know, practicing or whatever. And, you know, I really ain't done much anywhere else. I mean, I've had some places that I felt like I can catch some fish, but nothing to that extent. So I kind of felt bad for my co-owner. So I put my rods up and I took him to some places that where I caught two plus pound fish, where I've had, you know, some bites. And I let him fish, man. I wanted him to get a limit. And it also tells you, is there more fish in this area that you hadn't looked at, you know, or whatever, and you're kind of practicing with him, using him to practice for you, right? Yeah. I mean, dude, I was just so dialed in. I'm thinking to myself, I left him biting. There is no way that I'm not going to catch him the next day. There's just no way. I mean, you know, we all – Each day is different. I mean, we're dealing with a species that has a mind of its own and weather's changing, water's levels moving. So we really don't know. But at the time, I tried to make the best educated decision is to just shut it down, get the hell out of there. Didn't want to be seen there, for one, again, you know, because one boat done saw me the first day. So I'm trying to get out of there just as fast as I can so nobody see me. Because, I mean, I'm out of there by ten o'clock. I mean, they have, you know, four or five hours still left to fish. Right. Somebody could come up in there and, you know, do some damage. But now I got out of there and I'm thinking, man, if I just save what I have, you know, I may have an opportunity to win this thing. Make it happen. Big win. Two hundred thousand dollar tournament. Yeah. Big tournament. There's only two other tournaments bigger. That's red crest and the classic. That's it. So, and that's, that's why I signed up for this. I've never fished in all the Toyotas to try to qualify. And I fished enough. I did it through the wild card and I, and I qualified this year because I got to look and I'm like, man, this is a good tournament to be. Yeah. So I went, I went for it and, I'm gonna try to make it next year yeah you figure you know four tournaments what are they what are eighteen hundred now at an event yeah um yeah then qualifying to have a chance to go win two hundred over two hundred thousand dollars I mean it's a no-brainer yeah less than six thousand dollars you're paying uh fifty thousand dollars to try to go win three hundred I think I'd rather go pay, you know, what was it? Six thousand. Eight thousand. Less than ten thousand to go win two hundred. Yeah. Yeah. It's math. The math makes sense from a opportunity perspective. Absolutely. What do you think? You know, day three, not as good, not as magical. Yeah. Before we kind of just jump into day three, because we know what happened day three, let's talk more about day two. What do you think was the scenario? Day one, pretty good. A couple missed opportunities. Could have been a little bit better. Fifteen, sixteen pounds. Could have been maybe twenty. Day two, you just capitalize on everything, more or less. And you catch twenty-seven. a magical, ridiculous bag. Something's happening while you're there. Something in the ecosystem, the environment, the weather, the bait fish movement. What do you feel like set day two apart from day one and three? So I will tell you this. Like I said, I had an opportunity the first day and I didn't capitalize on it. You know, whatever. I didn't even know what I had because I found it at the last of the practice. But I think going into that second day versus the first day, it was overcast. It was sunny the first day. It was overcast the second day. It's spitting rain. You know, low pressure. I mean, I think they were just blowing up. You could see the big ones just hit and bring them. And I just – Man, I don't know. I think it was a perfect storm. The water had dropped even more, a little bit more. And I think it bunched them up a little bit more. And that day was just the magical day that I fell into it and they bit and I executed and it was just a perfect storm. The first day, like I said, was sunny, overcast. They bit first thing, but it got slower. And also, you got to think, you know, just going through there because I'm in the patch with my boat and I'm catching something, missing something. My co-hander was catching something, missing something. Pressure, pressure, you know, fishing pressure, number one. Them big fish, I mean, they, you know, whatever. So, and I honestly think that from day one to day two, I think I caught, I honestly think I caught fish that I missed the first day. You see what I'm saying? Yeah. Because you'll see them big fish up there waking. Right. But it wasn't like just everywhere. I mean, I felt like there, I felt like there was still more there the third day, but. I caught the aggressive ones. You know what I'm saying? I hooked up on some, and boom, they just come off. I think I caught some of those fish the second day. Gotcha. Gotcha. But going into the final day, just real quick, the water came up a little bit, and we had a lot cooler night. And I tell you, I think that was kind of the X factor. Fishing pressure, water coming up, and a lot cooler. And how was the sky on day three? Was it sunny or overcast? It was kind of partly sunny. The sun would come out a little bit, but it was mostly similar to the second day. I'm like, the conditions are pretty identical. There's a bit of rain minus the cool night. Now, did you see the bait fish moving as much on day three? Yeah, I didn't hear the bream popping as much. So the first couple of days, So it got slower each day. When I first got there the first day that morning, dude, there was bass blowing up everywhere, way out toward the edge. But most of them were small. But I think it was just a lot of activity. Boom, everywhere you hear, boom, we blow up. I mean, you can get a bite on every cast. That's how crazy it was. But most of them were small. Each day, that went away. The second day, it wasn't much blowing up. As the first day and third day, hardly any blowing up. So, like I said, I think it was fishing pressure, number one. Number two, water level change and it being a lot cooler going into that third day. So, man, I don't know. You know, we spent our time. Right, right. What could be – what adjustments should I have made? Should I have pulled way out in front of the pads? Did I pull out of the pads? Because we didn't – I did not get the bites that I've been getting, even small fish. Like, it was a grind to get a limit right there. Right, right. Mm-hmm. So, dude, awesome detail. Thank you for sharing that to the listeners. Thank you for sharing it to me. That's just good information for people to understand when they're looking at conditions, analyzing conditions, and understanding. what created magic for Keith Poche on that day because we all want to duplicate that somehow, whether it's a weather scenario, bait scenario. You caught most of your fish on frog. Is that right? Yeah. Every single one of them? Yes. Every fish I weighed in come on a frog. Well, no, take that back. I had one on a buzz bait. But, you know, after looking at the brim after the first day because I had a big brim in my live well, You know, I matched the frog. I changed a little bit to a Berkeley Swamp Lord, the Potomac color. Potomac. You know, it's got a lot of blue and orange in it. So I felt like that was a good selection to imitate those brim. You see what I'm saying? Yeah. Yeah. know I feel like the bass the bigger fish were so dialed in on those brim I think the smaller fish were busting small shad a little bit deeper but the bigger fish were deeper in those pads and they were concentrating on brim nice nice really nice I see that a lot of down here at amistad especially when we used to have a lot of hydrilla uh it seemed like there was always you know Bigger fish, if you caught one and it had something choked, it was a lot of time of brim. So I can see that. As far as you already mentioned it and kind of wanted to go down this path, hindsight, you thought, man, should you have pulled out a little bit more day three or conditions changed a little bit? How do you adjust, flip more, yada, yada, yada. What was your final conclusion? Do you think that If you could have made an adjustment, what would it have been? If you could go back and try it again. I would have left about an hour, hour and a half into the day. Knowing how it went down the second day and seeing how it went down the third day, I kind of was giving them the benefit of the doubt of the cool air I was I was thinking they're going to turn on eventually let it warm up a little bit more right but and then the second hour is let it warm just a little bit more they need one more hour but I'm thinking I'm like man if I can just get three bites just three good bites I may have this yeah so that's why I stayed so long but but looking back if And look, I don't care who you are, what you can be the best fisherman ever. How do you leave twenty seven pounds and fit in an opportunity of twenty on day one? So my point, my point is, I don't care who you are, what level you are as a pro. We learn something every time we go. Bass still leaves Kevin Van Dam scratching his head. I mean, seriously. I think a lot of times we're scratching our heads like, what just happened? Why did they not bite today? Because if we knew the answer, we'd win every tournament there is. It doesn't happen that way. We take an educated guess and we apply what we feel like it's necessary to get the job done that day. And a lot of times it doesn't work out. That's just the nature of what we do. Yeah. Yeah. So it's a great point. Great point for listeners to understand, even from the best in the business, um, they leave you scratching your head. Like he, even Keith Poche scratching his head sometimes. So, so, uh, man, that's, that's a great stuff. Congratulations on a fricking fantastic event, man. That was, uh, It was fun to watch. I could see your excitement every time I could see, you know, even, even day three, I, two, I didn't get to see day two. I don't think you had a camera day too. It was just, you know, you kind of did that on your own and with co-angler. And it was great that, that he got to witness it. At least somebody saw it. But, uh, know day three it was fun to watch even though you know we didn't I didn't see you catch all that many fish I saw you catch a few fish on a frog and it was fun to watch and and I could see the excitement just just flowing flowing through your body so it was cool to uh cool to witness man and and shout out to hayden marbunk I believe that's how you say his last name winner of the uh toyota champion he got it done for facing sonar oh yeah yeah how Hey, good kid, man. Good kid. I couldn't be more happy for him. I congratulated him as soon as I got back. Yeah, fellow Southern Alabama guy, right? Yeah, yeah, he's around here somewhere. But now, man, hey, he got it done. He was consistent. He did what he needed to do to get the W, and I couldn't be more happy for him because I didn't catch him. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I saw, you know, looking at the standings and some of the highlights, saw Laker Howe finish third place, of course, Randy Howe's son. And interestingly enough, on the bank, more or less, you know. Top water fishing, don't want to walk and bait. A little bit more open water than what you had applied, more cover involved in your technique. His was more open. I don't even know what was under the water, but it looked like, you know, some sand or mud flats or rocky flats where the water had come down off some flats. And he was kind of catching probably some fish fungling out, as you mentioned, Keith, that water temp coming down. Do you think that there was a lot of fish past? you know, farther in backs of creeks than then you were able to ascertain? Or do you feel like, you know, kind of so what you. Yeah. Tell me a story. So, I mean, honestly, I mean, if if I could do it all over again, you know, say, you know, granted, I mean, you catch twenty five, twenty seven pounds. You have to go back to that area. Yeah. Yeah. If there was places that I, you know, I could take my little boat, my little my little and I had it there. um that I wanted to get back some creek you know just normal creeks that would have some shallow flats in front of it that you know stump field I can run through and get back now I wouldn't have caught you know anything monster bag but I feel like I can have a decent day nice whether that was whether that was fifteen pounds or more I don't know but yeah um if I knew how I was gonna go down on third day that's what I would have done right yeah very cool Well, it was fun to watch. Great job again. Man, let's try to change topics a little bit. Keeping it on the shallow, doing what Keith's strengths is, what Keith Poche loves to do. Man, what are some new baits? I know you work real closely with Abu. Lately, all we hear about is a lot of forward-facing sonar and this bait and that bait and how to jiggle this and jiggle that and what rolls and doesn't roll and yada, yada, yada. What's going on in the shallow world people are not paying attention to? What are some new things maybe that are on the market that maybe we've kind of missed? You know, you've got the Fritz side, you know, several years back before Ford facing got crazy was the last biggest shallow craze. What's been the latest one for you that you've had a lot of success on? Well, yeah. Well, first off, you know, like this event, I just finished the Berkeley Swamp Corps. That's something that's pretty new within the last year, year and a half. Of course, I'm really excited about it. It's something that I can bring into my arsenal of my style of fishing. But Berkley has been working on some new plastics as well. Actually, I just got them a couple days ago, and I'm super excited about them. I don't even think I can talk about them yet. I don't even know. But there's some little crawls in there, some little stuff that I'm going to really love to fish with. uh I've been waiting on these for a while now but uh you know yeah pure fishing they're you know berkeley abu garcia family they're working on a lot of stuff all the time um you know I think they got that new credge out which is that you know forward facing uh you know hard hard bait you know it's it it how many of those you got how many of those you got in your boat uh let me get back to you on that one I'm just messing with you. No. So, I mean, but, but I have fished it and it, and it does catch fish, man. And, you know, of course this is for, you know, they, they got them little minnows and stuff now. I mean, come on, man. That ain't my deal, bro. You know where I'm at with this. So, so pit boss, I hear you all the time, whether it's social media on your YouTube, which you haven't done. enough YouTube. You got to get back on off the grid now. We're going to talk about that. Actually, I was working on one before this interview. All right. We're going to get to that real quick. I know that you love to flip, obviously, and Pit Boss, one of your favorite plastics. What makes a Pit Boss so special? Why do I need to go put some Pit Boss in my basket? So, first off, I think Skeet Reese needs to take – I think they need to take Skeet Reese's name off there and put my name on there. We can call Skeet right now and tell him what's going on. I love you, Skeet. I'm kidding. I know, I know. But I'll probably throw a lot more than he does. But, you know, a lot of people are going to think I'm crazy, but I don't – you know, there's different sizes of pit balls, and I use the smallest one, the three-inch. Okay. Okay. I don't like a big, bulky bait. It's just the way it hits the water, splash, you know what I'm saying? That smaller three-inch is so subtle, you can skip it a lot better. You can fit it in tight little spots, whether it's flipping mats or flipping around laydowns. One of the reasons why I like that, if you ever put it on a hook, and you flip it in the water and you are a bathtub where you can see the bait, see the action. Okay. You take that thing, you lift, you fluff it up, dude, them legs, dude, it has so much action. Like you look at it and you're like, that's the dumbest looking thing ever. But man, I'm telling you when that thing's in the water, it is unreal. The action it has. And it's just a perfect size that, that, you know, I thought on a four out flipping hook, uh, Three eighths ounce weight most of the time. That is what that is my wheelhouse. If I can make that work, flip around, you know, wood, scattered grass, even open water around docks. I'm going to catch them on that. You know, I will go up and wait if it's thicker or flipping heavy stuff. But man, that's all I use pretty much exclusively is the three inch green pumpkin, black and blue. But it's got a lot of action. I think it's the size and the profile and the way those legs are kicking in the back. It's just enough. It's just enough. If you take it like a speed crawl or reaction innovation, I don't even use that stuff no more. Sweet beaver, yeah. Yeah, but it's pretty similar. It's the same kind of stuff, but a sweet beaver's reaction, they're so big. Like back in the day when I used to use them, I would lose fish because there was too much plastic. I think it's overkill. I think it's too big. I think, you know, having that smaller size, you got to think of these high pressure lakes too. You know, those fish are looking for something that looks natural, something that's petite, something that they can just eat real easy. And they're not wanting a big, big bait all the time. You know what I'm saying? It's all about, I'm kind of finesse flipping in a way. I'm kind of... I'm glad I asked. I'm glad I asked. It's kind of an off-the-cuff question, but I know that you love the pit boss, but I had no clue that the three-inch was the wheelhouse. That is the deal, son. If you throwing anything but the three-inch, in my opinion, now, look, that's Keith Post's shit. People may whack him on a four-inch, but look, bro, when I got that three-inch in my hand, that three-inch pit boss is the deal. All right, so we talked flipping, we talked frogging. Man, we're getting into late fall, you know. Biggest cold front of the year is coming on to us. When this water temperature drops that next level, we kind of hit this later fall scenario. Are you still throwing a frog? Are you still flipping? Or are you going to change something? What's Keith going to be around once that water temperature gets into that, you know, low sixties, high fifties, where are you headed? Well, I probably, I probably be at the house with my feet up and I mean, this kind of depends on, you know, of course depends on where you're in the country, but I mean, you're going to have to slow down a little bit. I'll be, I'll be honest with you. Some of these, some of these Kusa river lakes around here, I've caught them on a spoon. These fish, especially as big spots, They'll start ganging up and running some bait. I catch them on a big spoon, you know, six-inch spoon, whatever. And then, of course, they'll bust every so often. You catch them on top. But, you know, it gets a little cool. But that or, you know, suspending jerkbait is always. That's when you throw that cred in your boat. I'm thinking of that credge up in there. That's it. I like that name. It kind of rolls off the tongue a little bit. Yeah, yeah. Like you're in the hood or something. You got some credge, son. Come on, give me some credge. Anyway, here we go. This is what I want to ask next. This is a pretty new, pretty new little topic. What would affect a guy fishing a Bass Pro Tour event with the catchway release? But here's some bass guys, five fish guys, Alabama bass trails going to affect a lot of team tournament trails, going to affect some BFLs. State of Alabama, did you hear this yet? State of Alabama saying they want to throw a slot limit down for tournament competitions. Yeah, you know, I don't really understand the thinking behind that because, That only applies to tournaments. So I could go out there as a resident of Alabama and buy my official license, and I can go catch the limit, whatever the state limit is, and I can bring them back home, and I can filet them, and I can put them in some cornmeal with some salt and pepper, and I can fry them suckers. And go back and get five more the next day. I'll go back and get some more. I don't understand their premise behind that. Maybe because I'm just trying to, you know, think outside the box. There's so many tournaments on these bodies of water. They're trying to push back a little bit. I mean, they may be trying to preserve a little bit of that, you know, that those fish that are, you know, they're just trying to protect them a little bit more, but Here we go. A lot of tournament anglers in Alabama. The hardest thing in the world to do, we both know it, a lot of people know it out there, is to get tournament anglers on the same page and working together for a goal. Sometimes it starts off good. We hadn't ever seen it really end well yet. We still got some life to go, but we ain't seen it end well yet. But do you think that tournament anglers can get together and have an impact to kind of, you know, have an effect on what the state of Alabama will do as it progresses here before the new season comes into effect? You know, Kurt, I don't I don't know. there again, I mean, try to get a group of anglers together. I mean, it's like herding cats and chickens. I mean, you know, I don't know if that's possible, but, you know, I think it will take going through a season and dealing with it to maybe piss a lot, enough people off to, to, to push them to say, Hey, enough is enough and figure out what they can do to figure it out. I, you know, I've heard about this, Kurt. I have not, I don't really know how far along they are. I don't really know the details of what's actually going on. But from what I've heard, it stinks. It's not a good deal, and I'm not for it, for sure. Yeah, and I don't know a whole lot about it either. Obviously, it's all kind of new, and who knows where it's going and how much anglers or tournament anglers care enough to – get together to uh try to make you know their voice heard appropriately but uh you know I figured you know talking to an alabama guy um I had to bring it up you know I don't fish here much I know I know I know but you still you know it's still your home state I mean gee you you voted in the presidential election you know you gotta throw in your word right you know yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah Anyway, we ain't going to get into politics now. We're going to stay away from that. You sure? You don't want to? Well, I'm happy where we're headed. Don't get me wrong. I'm very happy where we're headed. But, yeah, politics ain't for Bass Edge. All right, here we go. Thank you for sharing that tip on the pit balls. I think that's a good one. Listeners will really like that. They'll give it a swing. So, MLF BBT, going to sixty-ish anglers this year. I didn't really count down the whole list, but – you know, you're, you're going to be back. There are some anglers that aren't going to be back. Some, some going to fish invitational. So I'm going to go fish bass. We'll just kind of see how that all, all, you know, flushes out. You might say, but, uh, they're going to reduce it again. Um, you're in a good spot. If you catch them, you stay, um, you know, you, you're in a, you're in a good area where you are in the points in that. Um, what's your feel? How's it going to change in twenty, twenty five, uh, from a competition standpoint do you feel like it's uh gonna kind of free up a little bit because you have less pressure you talked about pressure there wheeler lake and how that might have affected some of your fish maybe that was some of your own pressure but but uh at any rate it affects things how do you think what's your thought process on bbt going to fewer anglers you like it Well, you know, hey, man, it is what it is. I think eventually what it all boils down to is you're trying to figure out the fish. And if you figure out the fish, you don't have to worry about nobody else, nobody. You just hope you got it to yourself. But, you know, the format is changing. Instead of being two groups, you know, you got on-day, off-day, on-day, off-day, we're going to a four-day event. You fish every day. So you fish the first few days, you got to make the next cut and then to the championship. So it's a four day event instead of a, you know, a six day event. Which is better for family time, you know, being at home, doing sponsor stuff, taping more off the grids. Right. Yeah. We've got a shorter, shorter event. So I don't know. It's more of a traditional way of fishing. I got to change boats. You know, MLF implemented a one fifty horsepower minimum. So I got to I got to get a little bit of a bigger boat, not much bigger boat. I don't know how that's going to affect me, but, you know, overall, I feel like I'm in the right place, you know, considering, you know, all the – there's drama everywhere. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Always is. I mean, it's, you know – Now, are you all doing the one day, one period on, one off, one on? And how does that work? Are you two forward-facing periods and one off? One forward-facing. One forward-facing. Two off. So I'm excited about that. I mean, like I said, I utilize forward-facing as well, but it's not part of my game a hundred percent. Like, you know, I do other stuff, but so I feel like, you know, I got an advantage over on that. It's going to be interesting to see how your Wheeler, and obviously Wheeler catches them anyway once, but your Connells, your Drew Gills, your forward-facing leaners, I'll call them. How did they practice? That's going to be odd. What period do you do it? What period do you utilize the live scope? If you use the first period, you're done the rest of the day. You can't use it. You can't pick it up. I don't know. I'll let them figure that out because I don't have to rely on it. That's not my MO. Overall, I feel like I'm in the right place. I'm fishing against some of the best anglers in the business. Hey, man, I'm just going to I may not be doing this in a couple of years. I may just be filming off the grids, you know, with all the drama, with all the stuff going on. I'm just, I'm it's. Hey, you keep winning fifty thousand a tournament. You'll stay after it. Well, but I may can make I may can make a lot more YouTube. So I hear you. I hear you do what do what your gut tells you to do. That's that's a good thing. Let's go back. You know, you were the only angler that I can think of. I know we. Y'all have to go back, listeners, and check out some of our previous interviews with Keith Poche. We've had him on Bass Edge at least once a year the last three or four years. That's what happens when you catch him on a regular basis like Keith has been doing. And you're a good friend of the show. Appreciate that, Keith. And, um, but elite series though, you, you did not stay with the elite series. You opted to go back to MLF and you had a choice to do what you wanted to do. Uh, elite series announced a couple of weeks ago, no entry fees, paybacks, a little suspect, but, uh, it's a, it's a big financial release. You have experienced that before first year in MLF Bass Pro Tour, no entry fees. Y'all had a, but, a better payback than the elite announced payback at this point. We don't, we don't know where that's headed, but what do you, what do you think about, you know, those guys and kind of what they're maybe going through from your perspective? I mean, you're a BBT guy, you're doing their MLF thing. You ain't really worried about it, but, You know, you're in the fishing industry. You're a professional angler. You kind of see what's going on around the world of professional angling. What's your thought process on that real quick? Give me two cents. Man, I feel sorry for them. I think it's diminishing the league. I think it's diminishing what BASS has accomplished, you know, whatever they have accomplished. I think it's a slap in the face almost. I understand what they're trying to do, but the only thing they're doing is helping the guy that never catches them. You see what I'm saying? They're not helping the guys that normally catch them. And I don't think that's fair to do. You shouldn't take that away from guys that consistently catch them. I think if somebody can't afford to be there, then, you know, I've been there. I did what I had to do. I've been there too. So, so I think, I think instead of, you know, this whole world of everybody gets a trophy and we've got to help everybody inclusive deal. I think you keep, I'd rather pay, pay to play to have a better outcome than, than pay to play. I mean, to not play and not, and not pay to play and not get any return. Right. Because there's been some people put together there, you know, put the numbers to pencil and paper and they're losing money. So the only thing this helps, the only person this helps is the guy that finishes last all the time. So, yeah. Great point. I mean, I hate, I hate, I hate it, but Hey, yeah. You know, we're just being transparent. We're looking at the numbers. We're, we're seeing, you know, opinions and, and, uh, they're important to be known because I think people need to look at all, all facets of what's going on in the world of fishing. Um, if you love it and you, and you have a passion for it, you know, that's why we talk about it because it's, it's what we like to do. All right. I kind of precursor. This is our last topic right here, but, uh, man, I, I've been jonesing for some off the grid, man. You've been, you've been dark on us. Where were you at? I've been, dude, I fished the bass pro tour, uh, I fished the Invitationals. You have been busy. I fished the Toyotas. Man, and I lost my camera guy last year. I mean, I couldn't get the dude out to bed. I mean, you know, look, man, I could go on and on about that, but I'm not. I'm actually looking for a camera guy. Well, get this. We need to send in applications? Where can listeners send in applications? Go to my social media. Any social media. DM. Hit the DM. I just filmed one on Wheeler a couple months ago, but I didn't want to air it until after the tournament. You can't get there anyway. Dude, I've been editing it. This is some good stuff. It's so good. I had a buddy go film with me. It's all cell phone only. Next week, I don't know when this show is airing or whatever, but on the twenty-second of of uh november guess where I'm going to film an offer I I didn't I didn't hire the big time camera got him flying him down friday february I mean friday november twenty second you know where we're going to film tell me something the gulf of mexico oh boy we're going to catch some salty ones huh hey bro I'm gonna put that little eighteen foot boat with that one fifteen marker and we're gonna We're going to head on out, bud. We're going to head south. I like it. I like it. I may not come back, but we're going to. So you're going back home to Louisiana? No, we're going to go down to Orange Beach. Okay. Just go out from there. So you're trying to catch actual saltwater fish. Yeah, I'm going to catch fish as big as my boat. I've seen some of this stuff on YouTube and them kayaks, you know. Them guys will lay into some big old thing and drag them around. You're going to be in the same deal. I mean, your boat ain't no kayak, obviously. But you could catch one as big as your boat, like you said. Hey, bro, it's going to be intense, man. I don't know what the wind is going to be like, but we got a schedule. We're about to – Awesome, man. Well, I love the Off the Grid episodes and look forward to the Wheeler one. That'll be coming, dropping soon. Unassociated with the tournament, just Off the Grid. I filmed this. You can tell the water was high in this event. That'll be fun to watch. Fun to watch. Then we'll log in and catch the Golf of Mexico. Make sure you subscribe to Off the Grid. Is the channel Off the Grid or is it Keith Poche? Man, I might need to change it. Keith Poche is my channel. Okay. Off the grid is the deal, yeah. You know, I watch – I'm a Pittsburgh Steelers fan, and I watch footballing with Ben Roethlisberger. My wife and I like to check it out. He's got a cool dude on him with him, this guy Spence, and they do a great podcast. It's fun to watch. My wife's getting more into podcasting. She'll even watch the – The Kelsey guys go at it every once in a while. Travis Kelsey and Jays or whatever his name is. What is that podcast called? Man, I don't watch it. I really don't. Anyway, so she's getting into it. So we started watching this football. But the reason I tell you this is because his channel is called Channel Seven. But then his show is called Footballing. So it's like F O T B A L H N or something. Yeah. Yeah. Anyway, it's a, so I don't know, maybe it's just some little SOE deal or something, you know, but probably a lot of people getting on Google wondering Keith Poche versus off the grid. I guess if they Google either one, they'll find it because you got both. Yeah. It's tied to both. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'm a subscriber. If the listeners are not a subscriber, make sure you go check out Keith's YouTube channel. Keith Beauches are off the grid and enjoy some old episodes and apparently some new ones coming up shortly. Yes, sir. All right, man. Well, Keith, it's been awesome having you on the show once again here on Bass Edge Radio. You got any final thoughts for some listeners? Man, I don't know. I mean, hey, Stay off drugs. Stay in school. Those are all good advice. How's your daughters doing, by the way? You got two daughters? Let me tell you something. They are so smart. They make straight A's. They're cheerleaders. They're awesome cheerleaders. I don't even know what to say. I couldn't be more proud of them. They're happy to have Daddy Keith around for the next couple months. He's not on the road as much. That's good. Make sure you tell wife I said hello, Brandy. Say hi to her. I went with the Mackinac Island not too long before our anniversary. No kidding. Yeah, we thought about it. Yeah, we had a good time. Rekindled the whole bike. We biked around that whole daggum island, didn't we? Man, that was terrible. We did it again. Yeah, terrible. I was worn out. Outstanding, man. Keith, it's great catching up with you. Y'all stay tuned. We're going to be back. We're going to be back. Radio close out this episode. It's being a part of this program, man. Thank you, man. Good to see you. Absolutely, Keith. Y'all stay tuned. We're going to come back right after this message. Later, Keith. Come on, man. Let's roll. What the? To catch the fish, you need to be one with the fish. With Power-Pole shallow water anchors, you'll get the ultimate in precision, power, and control, so you can catch more fish. No face paint or phony fins necessary. Excessive shock and vibration are two leading causes for premature battery failure. Prolong the life of your batteries with the new MegaWear Battery Guard. The Battery Guard sits under your battery and absorbs excessive vibration and bounce, reducing G-shock by up to eighty percent. Great for boats or anywhere shock and vibration can damage a battery. The Battery Guard can easily be trimmed to fit virtually any custom shape or battery size. Save money by protecting your batteries. Spend more time on the water and less on maintenance. Find yours at MegaWear.com. what up what up what up welcome back we're closing segment here bass edge radio with some sweet music shout out to steve leslie on uh some fine fine intro and exit music from bass edge radio all right uh man I just wanted to recap real quick um thank you guys for being here um We're going to have another show coming up in twenty twenty four in December. And we're not sure who the guest list is going to be yet, but we're going to try to get an old school host back on the show. We'll probably get some old school hosts. Old Bass, I say Old Bass Edge friends on the show as well. Maybe try to kick a little Pete Ponce, a little James Niggemeier, kind of precursor. Maybe we'll try to get Aaron Martin back on the show just for a quick segment or two. We will see. But yeah, we're going to have another show here at the end of December. So make sure you stay tuned to the channel again. Hope you enjoyed last episode, four hundred and twenty three with Brian Schmidt, Gray Buck, Mike Grogan and myself talking fall bassing. You want to catch more fall fish. Make sure you go back and check that out. Make sure you rewind to the front of this interview if you hadn't seen it with Rick Harris. And of course, Keith Poche, our two guests. Thanks, those guys, for being with us here on the show once again. Man, it's always a pleasure doing this. Bass Edge Radio podcast. Man, that's kind of all I got to say. Make sure you subscribe. Make sure you enjoy some bass fishing. Thanksgiving holiday coming up. Gobble, gobble, gobble. Enjoy your Thanksgiving holiday and we will see you in December with another episode of Bass Edge Radio. Bye-bye.